New cab & head opinions

[Jim Edgemont]

Hey folks,

I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.

I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.

I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

Also, anyone ever tried cabinets from Avatar? What do you think of
this one:

http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm

The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

[bass monkey]

wow, there are soooo many thougts here. There are a lot of good ones.
For that $ amount there are also great combos. The combo world has
come a long way.

Eden
Ampeg
SWR

Post by Jim Edgemont
Hey folks,
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.
Also, anyone ever tried cabinets from Avatar? What do you think of
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

[Lane Baldwin]

Post by bass monkey
wow, there are soooo many thougts here. There are a lot of good ones.
For that $ amount there are also great combos. The combo world has
come a long way.
Eden
Ampeg
SWR

As a follow-up to this, I'll offer these thoughts to the original poster:

You should be able to get a DC112XLT combo for under $1200.00...and for
about another $75, can get the Signature version, with the higher powered
head. Then, as your budget will allow, you can add up to three D112XLT
extension cabinets...ending up ultimately with 4 12s and tweeters powered by
approx. 625W RMS at 2 Ohms.

At NAMM, we were all quite pleased with the reception of the D112XLT with
two extension cabs underneath it. Lots of people were VERY impressed...and
the stack was powered by the standard head.

Keep Thumpin',

Lane

Ask not what bass can do for you...Ask what YOU can do for bass.

www.laneonbass.com

Special Projects Coordinator & Forum Moderator
Eden Electronics www.eden-electronics.com

[Kloka-mo']

I just bought the Avatar neo 2x10 and 15. Big size, big sound. Decent
build. Just right for haulin' around, spilling beer on, and sounding good.
--
-rob

\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by Jim Edgemont
Hey folks,
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.
Also, anyone ever tried cabinets from Avatar? What do you think of
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

[JoeBloe]

I have the same cabs and am just waiting for my power amp to arrive in
the mail. What are you running your's with and how is the quality (not
just quantity) of the sound? I've used the 2x10 as an extension to my
SWR combo, but now I plan on using both Avatar cabs with a QSC RMX 850
and PodXT as the preamp. I'm going to be running my Rick throught this
setup as well.

Post by Kloka-mo'
I just bought the Avatar neo 2x10 and 15. Big size, big sound. Decent
build. Just right for haulin' around, spilling beer on, and sounding good.
--
-rob
\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by Jim Edgemont
Hey folks,
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.
Also, anyone ever tried cabinets from Avatar? What do you think of
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

[Kloka-mo']

I'm powering mine with a ThunderFunk, the new 500w version, with the elusive
Tube-y switch (makes it sound tubey-er, honestly).

I have only heard it in my bedroom, for a few moments, till I heard the lamp
fixture on the first floor fall off the ceiling :-) So, it was LOUD, and
had a good general bass sound. Everything set flat.

I've rehearsed twice with just the 2x10, and my maple Pedulla 5 J-2000. I
didn't care for the sound of my D and G string, and I didn't have time to
figure what I could change to get rid of the boxy sound I was getting.

Tomorrow, I get to play a gig with both the 210 and 115. I'll let you know
how THAT sounds.

I'm not a *tone* guy, as much as I want old school bass sounds. I sold my
Zons and Eden stuff for that reason.

I think the maple/maple/maple Pedulla is going next, in favor of a passive,
rosewood necked 5. Either a Lakland or a Roscoe Beck Fender. Add in a twin
fretless, and I'll be done. :-)

My friend Ted, who is a Pro bassist, took the 210 to a Jazz gig, with two
Zons. He thought it sounded good. Better than the price tag. For him, it
was perfect. Don't need hi-fi sounding at most gigs, and don't want to
worry about scuffing your $2000 Epiphani... these are the deal. Will it
sparkle like some speakers? Don't know, don't care. I'd say, that with a
Ric, it will be a good combo. Don't need a Walter Woods for a Ric. :-)
Great bass, but not Hi-Fi.
--
-rob

\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by JoeBloe
I have the same cabs and am just waiting for my power amp to arrive in
the mail. What are you running your's with and how is the quality (not
just quantity) of the sound? I've used the 2x10 as an extension to my
SWR combo, but now I plan on using both Avatar cabs with a QSC RMX 850
and PodXT as the preamp. I'm going to be running my Rick throught this
setup as well.

Post by Kloka-mo'
I just bought the Avatar neo 2x10 and 15. Big size, big sound. Decent
build. Just right for haulin' around, spilling beer on, and sounding good.
--
-rob
\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by Jim Edgemont
Hey folks,
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.
Also, anyone ever tried cabinets from Avatar? What do you think of
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

[coreybenson]

Post by Kloka-mo'
I'm not a *tone* guy, as much as I want old school bass sounds. I sold my
Zons and Eden stuff for that reason.

Hey Rob... Insterestings commentsia. I can totally dig why you sold
the Zons if you wanted a more old school sound, but why for dis dem
Edens? Heck, that's why I OWN mine! lol

Which Edens did you have? (For the record: I don't think Eden is the
be-all/end-all solution for everybody, but mine are paid for and I do
luvs em!)

I tried out the Bergantino 3x10" a couple months ago. I think I could
be talked into just carrying one of those around instead of my two
D410XLT's in a pinch, but HOOEY do they want large piles of money fer
em!

How goes the digging out down there, by they way? Is it starting to
look decent yet?

Corey

[Kloka-mo']

I'm sorry Corey, I stated that wrong. I got rid of my Eden 410XLT because I
wasn't using it, and everything ELSE in my Wisconsin storage space was
getting moldy. The reason I didn't go Eden AGAIN was I heard the
Thunderfunk was patterened after classic AMPs (I know... a few models away
from SWR, then Eden I suppose). And the low mid bump in the cab was NOT old
school. I REALLY wanted just two 15s, but that would be too MUCH flap.
With the Avatars being WAYYYY less, good reviews, and my general situation,
Avatar was it. I rarely play. After today's gig, lucky they ain't in the
Ole' Miss. river.

How is it down here? It's the worlds largest trailer park. It's starting
to warm up too. I can't imagine what all these people in trailers (sans
A/C) are going to act and smell like. The ones in front of their
$300,000.00 homes should be fine, but the ones that are all jammed into the
makeshift parks, on blacktop parking lots, one foot from each other...
Should be interesting when it gets hot again.

Milllions of houses still destroyed. Still can't squeeze into most
resturants during normal hours. Still large sections of town(s) without
power.

Housing prices are through the roof (those places that have roofs). Got a
co-worker who can't get anyone to rebuild his bathroom because it's a small
job. Not enough money. Got new co-workers transfering in, living with
their kids in barracks.

Tons of trucks with crappy homemade trailers, dropping hammers and crap off
the back of them at 70 Mph... Tons of foreign workers, crowding hotels and
bars.

The place sucks, basically. Think: Terminator. The post apocalyptic
devistation is still around for miles and miles. So yea... it a happy
place. Let the good times roll!! Lez' Le Bon ton rue', or however they
used to spell that around here. There's a phrase I ain't heard in a while
:-)

Glad I'll be in San Diego all next week :-)

Happy Passover!
--
-rob

\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by coreybenson

Post by Kloka-mo'
I'm not a *tone* guy, as much as I want old school bass sounds. I sold my
Zons and Eden stuff for that reason.

Hey Rob... Insterestings commentsia. I can totally dig why you sold
the Zons if you wanted a more old school sound, but why for dis dem
Edens? Heck, that's why I OWN mine! lol
Which Edens did you have? (For the record: I don't think Eden is the
be-all/end-all solution for everybody, but mine are paid for and I do
luvs em!)
I tried out the Bergantino 3x10" a couple months ago. I think I could
be talked into just carrying one of those around instead of my two
D410XLT's in a pinch, but HOOEY do they want large piles of money fer
em!
How goes the digging out down there, by they way? Is it starting to
look decent yet?
Corey

[Kloka-mo']

Post by Kloka-mo'
Tomorrow, I get to play a gig with both the 210 and 115. I'll let you
know how THAT sounds.

I'm a big fat liar. Room was small, and no crowd, so I only used the 2x10.
Sounded better today. Bigger room I guess. No significant characteristics
to write about though, sorry. Amp set flat, bass set totally flat too.
Tweeter turned down to 15% -ish, on the 210.

Let an unknown bassist sit in. He used one of those FEW solid bodied Martin
basses ever made. He was too boomy. He couldn't figure out the bass line
to Papa Was a Rollin' Stone either, but who am I to judge. I screwed up
every song I played.

[p e r]

"Jim Edgemont"

Post by Jim Edgemont
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

Not really light weight for a neo, i guess there are quality woods in it...
Per

[Kloka-mo']

That's true. I was shocked that the 2x10 was significantly heavier than the
Carvin 210 it replaced. The Avatars do have steel handles as well.
--
-rob

\ /
O
@( ,, )

Post by p e r
"Jim Edgemont"

Post by Jim Edgemont
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/B410%20NEO.htm
The price looks tempting, but I'm concerned about sound and quality.

Not really light weight for a neo, i guess there are quality woods in it...
Per

[Kloka-mo']

Oh, not for the OP, but it handles the low B perfectly, just the 2x10.
Filled the room, which held about ten tables, a dance floor, and a bar.

[Michael L Kankiewicz]

Post by Jim Edgemont
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

Din't Squire play through a Marshall head for a while? I could be
mistaken.

MK

[Scott McDaniel]

Post by Michael L Kankiewicz

Post by Jim Edgemont
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

Din't Squire play through a Marshall head for a while? I could be
mistaken.

"Chris' current stage setup includes a Marshall 100 watt Super Bass Amp and
Marshall 4 X12 cabinet, two SVT-2 pro heads and two 8x10 SVT-810e cabinets,
which sit behind him on stage (left).
The bass pedals are amplified by an SWR SM-500 head driving an Energy 2x15
cabinet, which is located under the drum riser. "

This may be a bit much for what Jim is looking for.

For smaller venues I use a Roland 150 watt combo with 1 15 and a carvin
cabinet with another 1 15.

This is TONS of presence and tone for both my basses (including 5, 6, 8, and
12 string basses) and my Taurus pedals.

I also use a Digitech BNX3 and a boss EQ.

I don't know why I think you care...

[a.rynosseros]

IF memory serves me correctly, Michael L Kankiewicz
<***@buffalo.edu> would prepare alt.guitar.rickenbacker with a
touch of
<Pine.GSO.4.05.10604111953381.13825-***@callisto.acsu.buffalo.edu>,
much to Takata-san's delight...

ALLEZ-CUISINE!!!

Post by Michael L Kankiewicz

Post by Jim Edgemont
I have a 1983 Rickenbacker 4003 and will soon be purchasing a rig for
it. I haven't had a really nice rig since I've owned the bass, so I'm
excited about this.
I will have a $1200 budget, and want to get the most bang for my buck.
I need a cab, head, and if there's money left after that, some
effects.
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

Din't Squire play through a Marshall head for a while? I could be
mistaken.
MK

From http://chrissquire.com/

Chris' current stage setup includes a Marshall 100 watt Super Bass Amp
and Marshall 4 X12 cabinet, two SVT-2 pro heads and two 8x10 SVT-810e
cabinets, which sit behind him on stage (left).

The bass pedals are amplified by an SWR SM-500 head driving an Energy
2x15 cabinet, which is located under the drum riser.

=======================================

I understand Squire used Sunn amps and cabinets at an early stage.


-
Ryno is a rude bastard and doesn't do email.

My opinions may not be those of my employers,
and should not be construed as representing them.

[Javier González Nicolini]

Post by Jim Edgemont
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

One of the parts of Geddy's sound is a Sansamp RBI - you might want to
try that piece of gear.

[Todd H.]

Post by Javier González Nicolini

Post by Jim Edgemont
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

One of the parts of Geddy's sound is a Sansamp RBI - you might want to
try that piece of gear.

Last interview with him I read a year or so ago actually, it was a far
more esoteric preamp actually--Avalon U5. Most of the geddyness comes
from some parametric eq's.

Here's the interview:
http://www.guitarcenter.com/interview/geddylee/index.cfm

And more:
http://www.backstage-lounge.com/story.asp?sectioncode=66&storycode=5729

[Kraig Olmstead]

The GC article is from before Vapor Trails (he's promoing his solo
record), which was recorded in 2001 or 2002.

He had a cover story not too many months ago in Bass Player. My
recollection was that he'd gone mostly to SVT's, but I could be wrong
about that.

I agree with Jim Edgemont that a Sans Amp would be a good choice. Geddy
used or uses them, so it's authentic. I'd recommend the Bass Driver DI
just because it's cheaper, more portable and has great utility for a
variety of purposes. No, it's not as authentic as the RBI, but it gets
you close.

KO

Post by Todd H.

Post by Javier González Nicolini

Post by Jim Edgemont
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

One of the parts of Geddy's sound is a Sansamp RBI - you might want to
try that piece of gear.

Last interview with him I read a year or so ago actually, it was a far
more esoteric preamp actually--Avalon U5. Most of the geddyness comes
from some parametric eq's.
http://www.guitarcenter.com/interview/geddylee/index.cfm
http://www.backstage-lounge.com/story.asp?sectioncode=66&storycode=5729

[Kraig Olmstead]

My recollection was wrong. He's still using the Avalon/RBBI/Palmer.
SVT was back in '93. I still recommend the Bass Driver DI for the
reasons I outlined below: The BDDI is a good piece of gear to own, it's
close enough to the RBBI, it could fit in your gig bag (it does mine)
and it's less expensive than the RBBI.

KO

Post by Kraig Olmstead
The GC article is from before Vapor Trails (he's promoing his solo
record), which was recorded in 2001 or 2002.
He had a cover story not too many months ago in Bass Player. My
recollection was that he'd gone mostly to SVT's, but I could be wrong
about that.
I agree with Jim Edgemont that a Sans Amp would be a good choice. Geddy
used or uses them, so it's authentic. I'd recommend the Bass Driver DI
just because it's cheaper, more portable and has great utility for a
variety of purposes. No, it's not as authentic as the RBI, but it gets
you close.
KO

Post by Todd H.

Post by Javier González Nicolini

Post by Jim Edgemont
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

One of the parts of Geddy's sound is a Sansamp RBI - you might want to
try that piece of gear.

Last interview with him I read a year or so ago actually, it was a far
more esoteric preamp actually--Avalon U5. Most of the geddyness comes
from some parametric eq's.
http://www.guitarcenter.com/interview/geddylee/index.cfm
http://www.backstage-lounge.com/story.asp?sectioncode=66&storycode=5729

[g***@comcast.net]

I thought he used washing machines,,,, LOL

[the real mh]

Post by Javier González Nicolini

Post by Jim Edgemont
I want to get the Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound out of this, so I'd
like your recommendations. I won't be playing any big rooms, mostly
small stuff, so this won't need to be a huge rig.

One of the parts of Geddy's sound is a Sansamp RBI - you might want to
try that piece of gear.

By saying "Chris Squire/Geddy Lee sound", I would assume that the
original poster is looking (listening) for sounds/tones from earlier in
Geddy's career.

It's a pretty good bet that both Squier and Lee used their 4001s to full
capacity -- that is, running the Rick-o-Sound split to two separate
amps. Throw some distortion on one of those amps and voila -- instant
Squire/Lee.

I know from experimenting that I can use my Fender Jazz to get tones
reminiscent of Geddy's Moving Pictures-era setup. Again, having some
overdrive in the signal chain is the key.

Running two small combo amps and overdriving the signal might be one way
to get the tone.

If you don't want to constantly overdrive your power amp by running the
pre-gain pretty high, invest in a decent bass overdrive pedal.

[Jim Edgemont]

Thanks to all who responded. I have some great ideas to work on when
I'm shopping. I'll post back once I have it purchased and set up!